Ben Hart
Forum Replies Created
- Posts
Looks good!
Keep us posted with more photos when you get the rest done!
did you strip off the messed up product? If you mixed the clear that badly the first time, it will not be a good foundation for later products. It must be removed.
As for the bubbles, it could be as ding said…it could also be some reaction from the previous clear (if it wasn’t removed). Is the paint a little thicker on the edge (like it was almost about to start to run)?
[quote=”jimmo” post=20484]I know BASF has one called visionplus but not sure how powerful it is, what are you looking for it to do? I’d imagine ppg would have some sort of tracking software available for the certified first network.[/quote]
I think most have some sort of system/program out there. Sikkens has the Acoat Selected stuff. PPG also has something…PPG actually has their own estimating software as well (although not nearly as advanced as Mitchell).
Looks pretty!
I sprayed in a booth that was almost identical (except not a drive through) at one shop. It was older, but worked well for us.
Well…just about anything can be repaired…
The bumper is brobably cheaper to replace. Have you had an estimate done yet? From the pic, if it is indeed just the bumper, there is no way a shop would charge $2000. I would want to see the bumper off, incase there is damage to the re-bar/absorber and possibly the rear body panel. Is the corner of the tailgate damaged at all?
[quote=”csherwood71″ post=20377]Is anybody on here using HPC 21 clearcoat? We have been having a few issues with it lately and trying to figure out why. The clear is dying back big time after it sits overnite, doesn’t matter if it is over waterbase or solvent, looks like glass when I leave for the day and by the time I get to work in the morning it looks like a mat clear finish. Yes I am letting the base dry totally, tacking between coats and letting sit for 15-20 mins before I clear. We have heat in the booth and let fan run for 10-15 mins after to get overspray out of booth. The boss and I are both stumped on why this is happening. He called Sherwin Willaims today to see if anybody else using that clear is haveing the same problem and all he got was “never heard of that happening before, it must be something that your painter is doing wrong”. Why is it that most reps never think it is their product that is failing? It seems to me that the reps that work for Sherwin in our area are clueless on the products that they sell.
Anybody have any ideas or suggestions that I can try?Thanks
Chris[/quote]I have used it a couple of times…similar results. I suggest switching to another brand…:whistle:
If your rep hasn’t heard of the die back, then he isn’t listening.
I am not familiar enough with the product to have a solution, however…
[quote=”zarbat007″ post=20367]Hi everyone. I have a few questions about waterborne. I’m a hobbyist going to try practicing with waterborne again and I don’t have a booth.
1. I have almost a full gallon of Lesonal ProAir clear left. From what I read, Sikkens and PPG seem to have smilar technology for their waterborne. Do you think
the ProAir can be sprayed over PPG waterborne?2. I’ll be using a hair dryer to help flash the basecoat (cold setting). Is it possible to add a bit of isopropyl alcohol to the basecoat to help it flash faster?
I know not all waterborne paints are fully waterborne, but from my research Sikkens and PPG are “true” water paints and they seem to be the top choice. So, I think
adding isopropyl alcohol should help a lot.3. Sikkens calls for a 1.4 tip, some members here recommended 1.4HC. My SATA 3000 HVLP has 1.3. I have an Iwata LPH400 with orange cap and 1.4 tip.
I used to spray Diamont and the Sata was awesome at spraying mettalics. Much easier and better than the Iwata IMO.
My question is: how would both these guns perform?
I’m guessing Sata would be better suited for PPG, Iwata for Sikkens. Anyone sprayed Sikkens Autowave with LPH400, 1.4 and orange cap?4. Would a mixture of 1:1 water and alcohol be good enough for the final wipe?
Thanks everyone.[/quote]
Ok…
1. Sikkens and PPG are different brands. You can spray it over the base, it should work. I just can’t say that it won’t delaminate later on.2. Yes, iso flashes fast, but I don’t see how it would speed anything up. All adding it would do is dilute the colour and change the viscosity. The iso will flash off fast, but the rest of the water in the paint will still need to flash out. I do NOT recommend this. For drying, just make sure the area is warm (room temp) and has lots of air movement. Both PPG and Sikkens can flash off very fast.
3. Gun prefrence is totally dependant on your style/prefrence. I think my Devilbiss Tekna with a 1.3 (for PPG) or a 1.4 (for Sikkens) sprays them best. Your 3000 HVLP will work ok with the 1.3. Heck, it might work just fine, especially if you aren’t doing too large of jobs. I would experiment with the guns you have first then decide if a different gun or going to a 1.4 will work for you. The PPG sprays very nicely from the 1.3…
4. For a final wipe on metal, you still want to use a solvent based cleaner (to remove solvent based contaminants). You can buy cleaners to remove water based contaminants. Iso. alcohol works well, however, I think it is best at 70% (30% water)
[quote=”painter123″ post=20346]Looks like a good panel to use some lead on[/quote]
If it were too thin/pitted to weld, that would be my next choice.
But the fiberglass filler isn’t too bad, you should be able to coat the inside of the 1/4 where the filler will ooze through.
[quote=”ryanbrown999″ post=20329][quote=”5LEater” post=20328][quote=”Ben” post=20275]Basically most mixing systems have a straight black toner. Mixing blacks are usually a weaker black (less opaque). And sometimes there are blacks that have a little hue to them (typically yellow/red) which gives the black more of a brown look in bright day light.[/quote]
What would be the difference for example of the tinters “245, 400, 744.” on autowave. I know 744 is the mixing black, but 245 and 400 look pretty much the exact same to me. learn me! :p[/quote]
744 is a mixing black. it is weaker and has a blue sidetone. You would never use it for a main toner as it won’t look very good.
400 is stronger and has a yellow side tone. It can be used for a solid black but it wont look as good as 245. It can also be used as a mixing black when a yellow side is needed.
245 is a different kind of technology than the other autowave toners. it is ground finer and will be a deeper darker black. I think it was made at first for Toyota 202 black, but is used in most straight blacks now.[/quote]
Exactly.
Spray 1 or 2 coats of each on a spray out card, then clear them. Have a good look at them in direct sun light…there is a noticable difference. The straight 744 definately won’t cover in 1 coat…and may not even cover in 2. 400 and 245 both look different from eachother when there is enough light present.
[quote=”Jayson M” post=20320]I’m with Ryan,pro air,ACIII,and HS+ all work better with a 1.4 compliant/rp spray gun not hvlp.I have had the 4000RP for the last 5 months and it is much different than the 3000rp,the 4000rp lays down a super smooth finish.
On the flip side I have been using a 3000 1.4HC hvlp for the last 2 years with autowave and it worked alright,but I had to work at some of the tougher colrs with silver dollar metallics in them(888EC toner) I have been trying a devilbiss tekna with a 1.4 and I am blown away at how much easier it is to spray those tougher colors.So Ben the regular 1.4 in the 4000hvlp might be better than the 1.4HC,but if you are loving the Tekna why change.I can’t believe how much better it sprays Autowave,and the fan is that much nicer.So Thanks to Ryan for peaking my interest in the tekna,but for clear and single stage it is RP all the way.[/quote]Yeah. I’m just trying the 4000 for shits and giggles. The Tekna is at least just as good or better. The Tekna seems to have a wider or more even fan and is a little easier to control the difficult metallics.
I did a gold front end with the Tekna a little bit ago, and so I am trying to decide how they compare since I just did a gold front end with the 4000.
Glad to hear the Tekna is working good for you too Jayson. What PSI are you using? I go 24 PSI and 19 for drop coat. That drop coat just makes the metallics lay so damn nice/blend out flawlessly.
We have had the 4000 HVLP as a demo for a few days, with a 1.4 tip (spraying Autowave). Painted a gold front end on an Avalanche with it yesterday…so far so good, but I am not quite feeling all the love that some others are. We well see how it performs on some other jobs.
Next week we should get the RP in to try clearing with…that is the one I am more excited about.
[quote=”Anonymous” post=20253]Ryan, Ben, and Jayson… Thanks for the info! Sorry about my anonymity for now, but the deal is not done yet, and everyone knows each other in this business! Doesn’t seem to matter where you are…
Ryan… Our Sikkens Rep. here is Steve Baran. Are you in SoCal?
Ben… I actually spent quite a bit of time going out to local shops that are spraying both systems, and would have to agree with you about coverage and color match. This was a big reason why Sikkens was brought to the table. I have a bunch of experience with Sherwin’s solvent, and always thought it was a very good product. But it seems they have some issues with AWX.
Jayson… I completely agree with what you stated about sprayable costs VS. coverage. With all discounts factored in, Sikkens basecoat was actually within pennies per sprayable quart to AWX using a list of the top 30 OEM colors sprayed on the market today. Take the coverage factor into account, and it really made Sikkens very comparable, even with the higher costs of clears, primer/sealer, etc.
Underpaid Painter… I always was a fan of Ultra 7000 too. I used it for about 5 years. Very productive, and their CC930, CC950, and HPC clears were very nice. Unfortunately, I can’t spray any of those products out here in CA. And from what I keep hearing, AWX needs some work yet. Most of the guys that really like Ultra 7000, are the guys that have sprayed Standox or Spies in the past. Sherwin owned Standox for awhile and stole a lot of their technology. So, since around 2004-05, Sherwin’s solvent has sprayed a lot like a true European basecoat. Which I always loved!
So, to the guys on here that are very familiar with Sikkens… What are your opinions on the EnergyPro 250 clear, and the LV II clear? I havent read to much feedback about the LV II? But I guess it is becoming one of the work-horse clears here in CA. Also, are you guys using the Colorbuild Plus 250 as you main primer/filler? I know it is their sealer also, I am just curious if everyone is using it as their work-horse primer, and if they are actually using it mixed to be close to the color of the car?, as it is meant to be used? I have also heard that Autowave had some problems in the past with their solid reds not being clean enough, and very difficult/time consuming to fix. Have they gotten this problem under control?
Sorry for the 20 questions. I like to know what i am getting myself into! I appreciate all of your feedback… :teach[/quote]
I have used the Ultra 7000 a bit, and it was a much better system than the AWX and low VOC products. I think if Underpaid Painter had the chance to compare AWX to Autowave he would feel similarly.
Good luck with whichever system you go with :cheers
Basically most mixing systems have a straight black toner. Mixing blacks are usually a weaker black (less opaque). And sometimes there are blacks that have a little hue to them (typically yellow/red) which gives the black more of a brown look in bright day light.
[quote=”vizard” post=20126]hey mate thanks for the reply.
Its all one brand, Protec. Its old left over stuff from when he got the front half of the car done ( it is a ute ) he already has the front end and doors done, im just doing his rear tray, rear quarters and tailgate.
hes given me the base, pearl and clear, but again im not sure if its enamel or urethane, if its either, will the clear dry dull or gloss? and yeh can i just use my 2k over the acrylic base and pearls?[/quote]
I’m not familiar with those products at all. Enamel or urethane, the clear should dry glossy. Is the clear not activated? Any 2k clear should work over the base.
I strongly suggest testing the products first to get a feel for them and make sure they work ok. Not sure how old they are, but some products just don’t age well…
Ok…you are painting a tri-stage white for someone…sounds like you are going to be blending the base (trying to match what is on there, not painting a complete).
Is this old product you are using, or something new that he is supplying? What brand(s) /product lines are these? Sounds like you may be mixing a bunch of different products…
If this is looking to be the way it sounds, then it seems pretty messed up to me. I wouldn’t trust the colour of the paint he gives you, at least not with out doing a let down panel first. Secondly, if you are mixing a bunch of different brands of products, you may be asking for trouble…