Simon Richards
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Sorry to thread hijack, but man, that thing is uglier than an Aztek!
[quote=”Nexson” post=26129]9 times out of ten, the first thing i do is scuff the whole bumper with presta scuff stuff and a gray pad, I don’t know what happened here :cheers[/quote]
I do….this was the one time out of ten!:whistle:
Looks good though Nexson!
What plastic adhesion promoter did you use before priming and what primer did you use? Ever thought of using a tintable primer?
I know exactly what you mean!
How anal are you on the pre-clean of the vehicle before it enters the shop? We pre-wash and high pressure clean the body, shuts, backsides of all doors/boots, wheel arches and undersides of the vehicle before we start any work.
You can put a heavy chain over the diff and let it sit on the floor. This will help ground out the vehicle to minimise static charge. I also replace the exhaust filter too. How clean are your inlet filters? Do you wet the floor when clearing?
When painting whites and silvers, I ALWAYS use a brand new disposable spray suit (Tyvek) for the job. I also tape my gloves off at the suit, rub my eyebrows, blow my face, body and respirator off several times, plus I always wear the hood in the suit. Use separate guns for base and clear, double strain all paint materials. make sure you are well nourished before you start a job like this. I know it sounds silly, but if you are fatigued/tired, it’s easy to make stupid mistakes/oversights that you’ll regret later (ie. forgetting to strain the paint or even tack off the job). Try to minimise your movements in and out of the booth and always keep the booth door closed. Helps if the other guys in the shop aren’t sanding and creating dust while you’re painting.
With solid whites, temperature permitting, you can use a fast reducer in the base which will limit the amount of ‘open time’ in the base. Don’t do this with a silver though!
If your booth has a concrete floor, you can tape off the underside of the car. This helps a lot! See an example of a car we painted below that came out very clean (BTW, the door looks very yellow but that’s just the digital camera):
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/be036d0a.jpg[/IMG]
The finished result:
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/79acd313.jpg[/IMG]
[quote=”jimmo” post=25860]We panel paint bumpers only and straight black sometimes. If its a huge pos or used car and we know the colors spot on the odd time we might but typically we would always blend.[/quote]
:agree
With insurance work, we’ll always put down for a blend and we get the money to do it.
With private work, we usually need to explain to the customer why we need to do it, but most of the time the customer will agree to pay to pay for the blend(s). We still take great care with the colour match even if we’re doing a blend.
Bumpers are most always edge painted unless it’s a 3 layer pearl.
For the exterior on a full respray, aim to do 3 pearl effect coats. However, as you’re doing the whole car including under the bonnet and boot, the door jambs and inside the doors as well as the boot shuts, you want to do only 1 or 2 coats of the pearl effect on these areas. Because if you do the full 3 coats on the inside, as you’ll have some overlap spray around the B pillar and C pillars and top of the fenders where they meet up to the body, and when you run your pearl effect coat, you’ll actually have a higher build-up on the edges which will look inconsistent.
Carefully clean the wheel arches, and under the scuttle panel. You don’t want crap blowing back into the job. Don’t forget to paint the boot and bonnet hinges as well!
Also, if you want to speed the job up, because your ground coat is a solid white, suggest you use a fast reducer. It will flash off quicker and there will be less chance of crap falling into the paint.
Lastly, as you can’t really denib the pearl effect coat between coats, painter hygeine is critically important when doing a 3 layer white pearl. Use a brand new spray suit, new respirator filters (if you’re not using an air-fed hood), blow off all the walls of your booth, wet the floor if able, blow yourself off regularly, tape off the gloves to the suit, double strain all your paint, use a new tack rag…and don’t leave the booth between coats if you can help it. Super clean your gun(s) before painting etc. No compromises, and no distractions. Also, make sure you’ve had something to eat before you paint so you can concentrate, and turn off your mobile phone.
Just a note on the spray suit…[u]wear the damn hood[/u] – even in the video posted above, it shits me when I see painters wear a suit and leave the hood hanging behind their back. They don’t cover their head so crap can fall in the paint. Had a 23 yo “I know it all” painter do a job for me once. I gave him a new suit and he refused to wear the hood probably because it didn’t look cool. Well, guess what….found one of his hairs under the clearcoat in the bumper. Man was I furious. Ripped him a new one on that as we needed to repaint the whole bar. :chair
Hope this all helps!!
Cheers,
Sime[quote=”InvictaRefinish” post=25483]If it was me I would use proper etch as I call it (not 1k stuff that comes in aerosol) then wet on wet and base and clear, simples.
We do alot of audis (aluminium panels) and they recommend the spies 4075 which is proper etch and on new panels and repairs and for any warrenty corrosion work we have to use the epoxy primer which can be used as an etch sanding and non snding surfacer just takes ages before you can do anything with it sand or recoat it. Ive always maintaned that etch should never be painted straight over with waterbase.[/quote]Agreed…we don’t use aerosol primers except the PPG G5, which is a 1K aerosol speifically used for rub throughs. And the MIPA product isn’t an aerosol. It comes in a tin.
And, we’re using Delrton GRS which is solvent-based. As mentioned, never had any problems basing straight onto the 2K D831 Universal etch after a 15min flash off. Often though, I will coat the etch with D825 before base as it is a tintable surfacer/primer.
When I paint aluminium/aluminum items that have been media blasted, if the surface is fine enough (ie. from Soda), we’ll use 2-3 coats of PPG D831 Etch Primer, a 15 min flash off and then straight to basecoat followed by clear. Otherwise you can do DG straight over the etch as well.
PPG do recommend a WOW primer over the top of the etch before base (or a sealer such as D825), but we’ve never had any issues and/or returns of any items painted in this ‘etch to base’ method. And I’m talking about things that get a lot of wear and tear including wheels and brake calipers. I actually prefer not having to apply a primer after the etch as it keeps my material build down.
Alternatively, you can get the frame powdercoated, and then base right onto the PC after it has been scuffed with a 500 grit dry pad.
PS> MIPA also have a 1K etch that you can base right onto.
[quote=”Wydir” post=25018]well you got to learn somehow how are people supposed to learn anything when all your advice tells them to have someone else do it.[/quote]
I’m all for learning through the DIY route…..but most all people don’t learn to swim when pushed into the deep end!
Suggest if the OP really wants to paint, he/she start small and practice on some test panels. Even then, it’s a big step up from painting a panel to an entire car!
If it is placed incorrectly (i.e. too close), you will obliterate plastic parts such as bumpers, mirrors etc.
In my shop, we use natural gas. I like it because it delivers a consistent temperature throughout the entire booth.
Ding, I run my 3000rp with a 1.3 tip. Instead of running the fluid wound all the way out (as most seem to recommend), try setting the fluid at 2.5 turns out (from full in/closed), then set your air pressure at 28-29psi with the fan 1/8 turn in (from full out).
I find the 3000RP great for clearing large jobs (ie full repaints and 2K doors) so I don’t use it that much because I’m not always doing full resprays. For my day to day work, I use a Devilbiss GTI Pro with a 1.3 trans tip (T1 for base and T2 for clear). It lays down lovely OEM looking orange peel and is great to manouver around the detail work. The other painter who works for me also uses a GTI Pro, although he uses the HVLP tip for both base and clear. Both types of tips work really well.
Hope this helps mate!
Cheers,
SimeAwesome! Thanks so much Ding and Wydir!
Are the names you listed for the 13076 colour the alternate names for Midnight Mist Blue, or did my customer get the name wrong?
LOL…..Mazda 34K Crystal White Pearl!! I painted my 2011 ZX-10R in it last week (variant 1). You might want to add some matting base to the effect layer to get the pearl to be coarser. I didn’t do it, but wished I had:
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/IMG_4355.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/IMG_4357.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/IMG_4373.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/IMG_4368.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/IMG_4372.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/IMG_4356.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/IMG_4362.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/IMG_4374.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n19/simon-richards/IMG_4376.jpg[/IMG]
You can’t base your opinion of a paint system on just one colour match. Where one colour might be great, another might be nowhere close.
DeBeer paint is regarded as ‘bottom of the barrel’ here, with most of the good shops using PPG, Standox and Glasurit.
I could be wrong, but DeBeer might be cheaper because they don’t have as many tinters in their system, so there’s colours are a ‘closest match’ based on that limitation.
Also, what sort of support are you going to get from the manufacturer?
[quote=”smooth” post=21176] if you add a hardener to a clear [b]it cannot be used after a half an hour[/b], because it starts to harden.[/quote]
Well, thats not exactly correct. I am unaware of any catalysed clearcoat system that becomes unusable after 30 minutes!
Even using a PPG D863 accelerated hardener, my potlife is 3 hours at 20 degrees celcius. With normal hardener, it extends to 6 hours at the same temperature.
That said, you can extend the potlife somewhat by leaving the catalysed clear in the fridge.
Looks great!
With deeper recesses, first, I’ll shoot a tack coat in there and let it flash for 10min or so. Then, I will turn my fan in, fluid in and air pressure down slightly so that it becomes more of a narrow jet. Then, you squirt the clear in there with a medium-fast pass. Also, too much air pressure and you’ll create positve pressure in the recess and the clear will bounce back against the wall of air, giving you a dry clear finish.
Test spray the jet on some paper first so you know how it’s going to lay down. Even practice on some old bumpers first. You [b]don’t[/b] want runs on curved recessed surfaces!
HTH.